Senate Climate and Energy Hearings Begin Next Week
Published July 02, 2009 @ 02:05PM PT
The first of four Senate hearings on energy and climate legislation will take place right after the nation [[less the New York State Senate, notes this disgusted New Yorker]] gets back from its Independence Day break.
Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.), chair of the Environment and Public Works committee, has scheduled four hearings for July. The first, on July 7, will feature three top officials from the Obama administration on a morning panel: Energy Secretary Steven Chu, EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson, an Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack.
The GOP has invited Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour to be part of an afternoon panel that will also feature representatives from Dow Chemical and the Natural Resources Defense Council, as well as Braddock, Pennsylvania MayorJohn Fetterman.
Gov. Barbour is considered one of the party's bright hopes for a 2012 presidential bid (especially in wake of recent sex scandals and other embarrassments that may have swept other party figures out of contention). It's not hard to predict what his testimony will be; On the Sunday, June 28 broadcast of "Face the Nation," Gov. Barbour slighted the House bill as an "energy tax," and described a fossil-fuel-dependent Republican energy strategy:
We want to use all of the American sources of energy we have. We have tremendous amounts of American energy, more off-shore drilling, more drilling in Alaska, more opening up of shales and tar sands in other places for oil and gas.
But also, nuclear energy is an enormous part of this country's future in electricity generation. Clean coal technology, to recognize we're the Saudi Arabia of coal and we want to be using that coal.
According to Darren Goode at CongressDaily ($ubs. required), the committee will have two hearings on July 14: one how agriculture and forestry can contribute to fighting global warming, and another on the transportation sector factors in to energy and climate policies.
On July 16, Boxer's fourth scheduled hearing will examine how business will need to transform to remain profitable in a low-carbon economy. It's very likely that legislators opposing greenhouse gas pollution caps will play the China and India cards at this hearing, arguing that if the US caps GHGs before India and China do, it will hurt the US economy. China, the US, and India are the world's first, second, and fourth-largest greenhouse gas polluters, respectively.
Goode writes,
Boxer is optimistic that at least one Republican senator will co-sponsor a cap-and-trade measure she wants to introduce this summer, an aide said...Democratic leaders in the climate debate are going to need the support of at least a couple of Republicans to reach that mark.
...Boxer this spring dispatched all panel Democrats to lead or co-lead various working groups tackling five key areas of a cap-and-trade bill to facilitate negotiations with moderates in both parties.
Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Conn., who had his seat on Boxer's committee taken away by Democratic leaders as punishment for campaigning for former GOP presidential nominee Sen. John McCain of Arizona, has been the leading liaison in trying to get McCain on board.
(Thanks, Josh!)
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Comments (7)
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There is clearly a lot of symbolism in passing carbon controls, and some evidence that it might actually be helpful in reducing atmospheric emissions just a bit. But it seems rather unlikely to me that anything will come out of the current debate beyond mildly useful symbolic legislation with unintended or unadvertised consequences. (Perhaps this is enough?) I don't think Congress or the population as a whole really has that good of a grasp of the subject. If you testified in front of Congress and said that heart surgery is cheap and easy and patients always recover quickly, you'd be laughed out of the room. But you can say things just as silly on the topic of energy and a lot of politicians will nod their heads in approval. Not a good situation to be in at the start of problem-solving.
I'll blather on for a couple of paragraphs with more specifics, but the paragraph above summarizes my point.
BLATHER SECTION: I suspect I know the answer to this, but I wonder: Has Congress agreed upon a reasonable range of values for how much energy will be needed in the future for transportation (oil) and for electric generation? That shouldn't be too partisan of a number. And have they agreed on a reasonable range of values for the monetary cost of supplying a given chunk of energy via a particular power source? Again, if you keep it to a range, it shouldn't be that partisan of an issue. (Environmental and security costs would be more partisan). It would seem that without these these concepts in hand, setting up any kind of an energy policy would be much more hit and miss, because you would not be able to gauge the $$$'s it will cost to maintain the supply.
Without some fixed assumptions, there can be pithy promises about having 20% renewables by 2020 with minimal cost to the consumer. There is probably a study out there that backs that up, and another which entirely refutes it. The difference is in the assumptions made. For instance, if you assume Americans will use something like 5% more or 5% less electric energy than they do now in 2020 - not too unreasonable an assumption - and with the cost ranges agreed upon for power supply types, it can be shown whether the 20% by 2020 is reasonable and what its monetary cost will be. (Perhaps it works out, I don't know.) On the other hand, if you assume Americans will use 40% less electricity in 2020 than now (a big shift), that changes the projections dramatically and makes 20% by 2020 a lot cheaper and easier to achieve. What I'm afraid is happening is there are a whole pile of mutually exclusive assumptions and value ranges in use as part of the current energy debate - which makes it less of reasoned debate and more of random chatter with backstage exercises in political power-brokering. (So what's new?)
James Aach, friend of wind turbines and the author of "Rad Decision", the insider novel of nuclear power.
Posted by James Aach on 07/02/2009 @ 04:01PM PT
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Forecasts by the Energy Information Agency are typically considered decent estimates of future energy demand.
Posted by Emily Gertz on 07/03/2009 @ 07:37AM PT
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I agree, the governmet figures are pretty good and non-biased. What I wonder is if these are the figures used by everyone in the discussion and in the development of the bills. The testimony and other chatter I hear makes me rather doubt it - because they are very daunting figures to grapple with. This is particularly true because our current (electric) energy production is heavily dependent on an aging power generation infrastructure, so new production facilities have to replace a lot of the old ones before any new construction can really start being counted against increased demand. Of course, the newer carbon-less sources also tend to be much more intermittent and less power-intensive, so it's not a simple exchange. (It might take 1000 of the largest wind turbines available to replace the MW of one coal installation, but even then you don't get the same consistent energy flow. I guess that's where a smart grid helps out.)
Another reason why I like to say the safest, cheapest, most environmentally friendly energy is that which we don't use at all. Conserve, conserve, conserve.
Posted by James Aach on 07/03/2009 @ 11:10AM PT
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I simply don't understand support of this bill. On the one hand, we do need to raise more tax revenue to prevent (if this is even possible any more) hyperinflation from the two wars, the stimulus, the bailout frenzy, and now the healthcare reform proposal. From that perspective, the cap and trade revenue is vital, as it will draw funds from all socioeconomic classes instead of trying to finance every proposed project with money from the popular-to-pick-on $250,000+ group. On the other hand, more heavily taxed corporate entities face no competitive disadvantage by passing the cost of the taxes immediately to their customers through rising prices. There are only four possible outcomes for energy markets: 1) an emissions-eliminating, cost-neutral innovation will enable companies to save the environment and face no resulting economic hardship (unlikely), or 2) energy companies will go out of business due to increased cost of business, 3) energy companies will stay in business but see a major hit in profits, or most likely, as corporations pursue self-preservation, 4) consumer fees rise for all energy companies simultaneously, and corporations bear none of the brunt of the new tax by acting in tandem. So either we witness a truly miraculous engineering feat or more companies go out of business or there is a nation-wide regressive tax on energy expenditures. I'm praying for a miracle, but the government is betting against one so that it can soak up middle class dollars without facing the political consequences of a traditional tax.
Head of the Democratic National Convention and Democratic Governor Tim Kaine spoke a little about cap and trade:
KAINE: Yeah, it would, it would be difficult for me to do either cap and trade or universal health care as governor if the feds don't do it.
(full transcript: http://motorcityliberal.blogspot.com/)
The reason that Kaine thinks it would be difficult to implement a cap and trade system in just Virginia is that the state would lose massive numbers of jobs and corporate tax dollars when/if energy producers moved their operations to other states to keep costs low. What's important to realize is that this same reasoning also holds on the international level. With no enforceable international mandate or equivalent system, energy producers would be well served to simply move their operations abroad. In this scenario, it is the United States that loses jobs and corporate tax dollars to competing countries. With corporations seeking to lower costs and nations seeking to attract corporations, only blind corporate patriotism will stop the flow. And that's just the economics.
The reality is that most of the fervent support for this bill is people that just want corporations held responsible for their environmentally unfriendly practices. This bill does that--but again, it's jurisdiction only extends to American soil. So when we cap our emissions but 20% of our energy production goes abroad to nations with no cap, net global emissions could increase! To use illuminating but arbitrary numbers, if the U.S. caps emissions at 1,000 emission units but loses 20% of energy production, we're using up all of our cap with only 80% of our previous culprits. That means that at least 1,250 emissions units (80% of 1,250 is 1,000) by companies that used to operate in the United States. The rest of the companies (more likely to be carbon emitters, as they fled the country to avoid carbon emissions taxes) are free to pollute indiscriminately. Given, a 20% outflow is a huge number, but the key to this point is that if the carbon emissions aren't decreased by more than the net outflow of energy production, a net INCREASE in global emissions would occur! One more time with arbitrary numbers: if we decrease emissions by 10% as a nation but lose 12% of energy production, global emissions increase by at least 2%. I support corporate environmental responsibility, but cap and trade just doesn't seem to make sense, economically or environmentally.
The only thing that does make sense is that the government needs more tax revenue to fund its rising debt, and even fleecing our top earners can't pay the bills. Sometimes change is just change, not improvement.
Posted by Matthew Fifer on 07/02/2009 @ 06:56PM PT
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The bill's got problems. But I think you're echoing some misinformation in the "tax revenue" bits. As currently written, unless I'm mistaken, the proceeds from the carbon market get passed back to ratepayers, to help keep electricity costs realistic during the transition to a lower-carbon economy. That's why, per the CBO's analysis, the cost will average out to only around $175 per household in 2020.
It's worthwhile to pull a bit more of Tim Kaine's words down (while excising the inane commentary from Glenn Beck in that transcript) since he's quite in favor of national carbon caps, and charging for carbon pollution, and makes good points about how important it is globally as well as nationally:
KAINE: Yeah, it would, it would be difficult for me to do either cap and trade or universal health care as governor if the feds don’t do it. I mean, I do think we’ve got to have a cap and trade or equivalent system to start to control carbon emissions. And we have to do it in a way that, you know, deals with our environmental challenges, doesn’t overly cripple industry, but that also is a strong enough leadership step so that there’s a meeting of world nations at Copenhagen in December. We really need India and China to do it too. You know, we don’t want to do it — they need to do that because they’re such growing economies. They won’t do it if we don’t.
HOST: Well, they won’t do it period, but that aside.
KAINE: Well, I think, I think that there’s a good chance that they will. Actually, there’s some good things that China’s doing that’s ahead of us on this right now.
KAINE: But they’re growing economies at a pace where they have their own challenges, but if we do not walk into Copenhagen in a leadership position, they’re going to not do anything either.
KAINE: So, I think we do need to move. But cap and trade program just in one state, frankly, I do not think is that workable.
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/06/26/glenn-becktreasonous/
Posted by Emily Gertz on 07/03/2009 @ 07:33AM PT
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This Wall Street Journal article has some more illuminating numbers; not sure where you got $175 from:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123655590609066021.html
Posted by Matthew Fifer on 07/03/2009 @ 03:40PM PT
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I get my numbers from the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office, which released an analysis of the Waxman-Markey bill in June:
http://globalwarming.change.org/blog/view/costs_of_carbon_reduction_by_2020_40-340_a_year_per_household
Posted by Emily Gertz on 07/03/2009 @ 09:35PM PT
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